Welcome to the one and only Saturday matchup of Lent Madness 2020. From here on out every contest will take place exclusively on the weekdays of Lent. In a word, today is SPECIAL! And to mark this special occasion, Margery Kempe, a 14th century mystic, takes on Eustace, an early Christian soldier.
Yesterday, Elizabeth soundly defeated Andrew 63% to 37% in a battle of Biblical saints. We’re still waiting for that first real nail-biter, but fear not! You’re guaranteed to have a number of them before our work is done here.
By the way, if you need to check out the results from previous matchups or view the updated bracket, just head over to the bracket page. Our trusty Bracket Czar, Adam Thomas, updates the page every day, in his inimitable manner.
Now go enjoy your Saturday and don’t forget to vote!
Margery Kempe
Margery was born into a prosperous family in about 1373, and at age twenty, she married John Kempe. She might have been like many other women of her time, known only through church records and occasional correspondence, except for The Book of Margery Kempe, the earliest surviving autobiographical writing in English that details her spiritual crisis, visions of Christ, and subsequent devotion to Jesus.
Margery herself could neither read nor write; she dictated her book to a priest in her later years. Margery’s book invites us into the life of a woman whose faith in God did not require her to edit herself but instead to offer her experience of God and her call as a disciple in unflinching, raw, humorous, and lovely glory.
Margery begins her book telling of her post-childbirth illness. She fasts and prays in response to horrific visions of demons. In this desperate state, Margery describes Jesus coming to her, saying to her she was not forsaken but loved. Margery devotes herself to Christ, eventually (after fourteen children) forcing her husband to honor her decision to live a life of chastity, calling on God to terrify her husband when he feels a desire to break this vow.
She is also imbued with the gift of tears, weeping and praying for hours in public and in private, especially when meditating upon the Passion of Christ. She begins a life of pilgrimage. She meets the Archbishop of Canterbury, is almost burned as a Lollard, visits with Julian of Norwich, and is arrested and examined as a heretic because she preached…as a woman. Margery travels alone to the Holy Land, Assisi, and Rome, walks the Santiago de Compostela, and engages in conversation with Christian mystics from all across Europe.
Margery did not dictate her book as a memoir or travel guide. She would likely not have considered her life experience alone worthy of recording. She instead recognized the profound, mystical, and even unsettling presence of God in her life and for that reason, sought to record the presence of the grace and mercy of God in her life so that God would be glorified. Her book is a wonderful testament to the grace of God in the extraordinary life of a woman who dared to be a disciple.
Collect for Margery Kempe
Direct our hearts, O Gracious God, and inspire our minds; that like your servant Margery Kempe, we might pass through the cloud of unknowing until we behold your glory face to face; in the Name of Jesus Christ our Lord; who with you and the Holy Spirit lives and reigns, one God, for ever and ever. Amen.
Eustace
Strange things can happen when a person is out alone in the mountains, as shown by the legend of Saint Eustace. During the reign of the emperor Trajan, a Roman general named Placidas left his quarters to hunt. While in the countryside outside of Rome, Placidas came upon a stag moving in his direction. Between the stag’s antlers he saw a figure of Jesus Christ on the cross, and as the animal approached, he heard a voice calling him by name.
The vision changed him; Placidas immediately sought baptism into the church for himself and his family, moving from a general in the armies of Rome, which was persecuting Christians, to being numbered among the persecuted. At his baptism, Placidas changed his name to Eustachius—or in its anglicized form, Eustace. A series of catastrophes followed: Eustace lost all his wealth, and his servants soon died of a plague. As if those calamities were not enough, Eustace’s wife, Theopista, was kidnapped by the ship’s captain when on a voyage at sea. At a later point, when the family was crossing a river, his sons were taken away by a wolf and a lion. Yet Eustace remained faithful.
Eustace’s military acumen remained in high demand, and he was recalled to the Roman legions. Upon his recall, Eustace somehow managed to both reunite with his wife and children and play a part in a victory for Rome’s armies. Yet when the time came after the army’s victory to offer sacrifices to the Roman gods, Eustace refused. Legend holds that Eustace and his family were then martyred for the Christian faith, suffering death by roasting in a bronze statue of a bull.
Eustace is counted among the Fourteen Holy Helpers—fourteen saints venerated together in Roman Catholic tradition because their intercession against illness came to be believed as particularly effective in response to the Black Death. Among other things, Eustace is the patron saint of hunters, trappers, and those facing trouble; his intercession is invoked against family discord and against fire (as some sources clearly note, both temporal and eternal). He is also the patron saint of Madrid, Spain. Eustace is remembered in the West on September 20.
Collect for Eustace
Almighty God, who gave your servant Eustace boldness to confess the Name of our Savior Jesus Christ before the rulers of this world, and courage to die for this faith: Grant that we may always be ready to give a reason for the hope that is in us, and to suffer gladly for the sake of our Lord Jesus Christ; who lives and reigns with you and the Holy Spirit, one God, for ever and ever. Amen.
Margery Kempe vs. Eustace
- Margery Kempe (70%, 6,120 Votes)
- Eustace (30%, 2,650 Votes)
Total Voters: 8,770
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Blessed with tears versus crosses on deers… You decide!
https://birdsonstix.wordpress.com/2020/02/29/lent-madness-meme-margery-kempe-versus-eustace/
“Tears vs. deers” – love it! Thanks for the humor to start the weekend.
{{groan}}
Eustace is no buttercup, no choker in the face of evil! Lift high the Cross! Vote Eustace!
I will ask Eustace to intercede for us as we face the possibilities of a world pandemic.
My thoughts also!
And mine as well!
Wonderful idea Barbara and Trisha, I agree!
Now, with Eustace the hunter, I’m sure
That his sight of the stag will endure;
A vision we’re able
To see on the label
Of a powerful German liqueur*.
see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jägermeister#/media/File:Jägermeister1.jpg
Outstanding!
Thanks for the daily limericks.
Look forward to to daily (well, almost daily) fix of Lent Madness limericks! Thank you!
Wonderful prose which is why I chose Eustace
Cabot never fails!
Is that St Eustace or St Hubert on the Jagermeister? I went with Eustace because my sisters’ high school was St Hubert, who also saw a stag with a cross between its antlers.
We don’t need tears confronting the devil’s injustice,
A buttercup or choker won’t do in evil’s face,
We need Jagermeister, for health, ist gut,
Prep for the Coronavirus brute,
We need strength as a stag! Lift high the Cross! Vote Eustace!
Thanks for the witty limericks — I look for them as soon as I cast my vote each day!
What the what?? Tis true! Well cool.
You are outdoing yourself, sir!
He certainly is!
I learn SO MUCH from this site!
Dear Neil: Thank you for the note on the adoption by architect Ludwig Mies van der Rohe in 1947 of the less is more. It was adopted by CoCo Chanel in the 1920’s. The most correct translation from french is less is always more. The original source turns out to be a poem by Robert Browning, entitled The Faultless Painter, published in 1855. The history of the less is more becomes more interesting as it moves from literature to fashion to architecture. Best, MJ
Fascinating. Thanks for the added historical information.
Brilliant!
I voted for Eustace in honor of all the sacrifices military families make.
God bless Kempe’s priest. He should be in next year’s bracket!
The life of Eustace reminds me of the life of Job. Still, he remained constant in his faith to the point of being martyred in a particularly horrible way.
I like the fact that Eustace is one of the Holy Helpers. Any enemy of the plague, bubonic or pneumonic, is a friend of mine.
Even though Eustace gets my vote today, I like that Margery Kemp dared to preach, risky behavior in her day. And fourteen children meaning, unless some were multiple births, fourteen times going through labor and delivery? I would embraced celibacy well before Margery did. A brave, eloquent woman, remarkable in any age.
Giving birth to 14 children is quite enough for my vote. Margery rocks.
I also voted for Margery. And after 14 children she deserves to win. And waiting that long before she decided to celibate. WOW!
As a licensed woman preacher, my vote must be for Margery Kempe!
Margery also tried her hand at running a Brewery. She has my vote.
Not Eustace Scrubb, then.
Maybe C.S. Lewis in another year?
He already has his Golden Halo. 2011.
Good thought!
Another year, indeed!
See https://frtim.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/lent-madness-201115.pdf
Another reason I picked Eustace today; I’ve always liked the “scrub” who, with Aslan’s help, overcomes his baser part to become a hero.
In the words of John McEnroe, “You Cannot Be Serious!” Eustace is really saint Hubert. There is a festival for him in San Hubert, Belgium. It goes on for days and it’s quite fun. I went to it and was calling him “Saint YouBert” and got weird looks or no response at all. I was giving the townspeople Saint Hubert medals painted in orange and green. Finally a lady who I gave a medal to looked me in the eye and saidt “San OoooBear,” the correct pronunciation. After I said his name the right way, the townspeople loved me and my medals, including their police who proudly wore my clasped medals on their uniforms. The reason I painted San Hubert in orange and green, with a gold cross in the stag’s antlers, is because San Hubert, according to me, is the patron saint of Jaegermeister! He is featured prominently on the bottle. The San Hubert festival is a lovely weekend long event and if you talk to Mark at the Code Pub, he will tell you about his work going to Africa helping all sorts of exotic felines. Hail San Hubert! Look at his painted medal and read his story by clicking my name. Visit San Hubert in Belgium!
I think I have to go to Belgium!
BTW St. Hubert was an eighth-century bishop in the Netherlands. What he has in common with St. Eustace is seeing a stag with a cross between its antlers.
Margery Kempe lived for God.
St. Eustace lived and died for God.
Oh, my! Before I could vote, I had to do a bit of research I lived in a small rural community in Germany (with a US Army base where armored divisions came to hone their artillery skills), called Wildflecken- “The Wild Place”. There the locals held St. Hubert in high esteem, and Hubert also found himself called to Christian piety by a stag with a crucifix entangled in its antlers! Was this the same stage that called Eustace? I don’t know, but I took it as a sign to me, so Eustace it is, today!
Or maybe it was Jaegermeister that they held in such high esteem…
The Holy Helpers! What is this? Monty Python!
You’re thinking of a “Holy Hand Grenade”, Michael.
Let me see, I seem to recall that is 3 oz. Jägermeister, 2 oz. mead and 6 oz. cold brew over cubes. Count to three (not four), then serve in a coconut shell. Guaranteed to produce a vision…
“Oh, don’t grovel! One think I can’t stand, it’s people groveling!” — words to live by. Right, Manny?
I’m averting my eyes, O Lord.
That made laugh out loud!
Thaks
I initially misread Margery’s profile – “Margery was born into a preposterous family …”
I felt something like kinship. She gets my vote
Margery Kempe had me at ” Margery’s book invites us into the life of a woman whose faith in God did not require her to edit herself but instead to offer her experience of God and her call as a disciple in unflinching, raw, humorous, and lovely glory.” Then I discovered her reaching out to other holy people such as Julian of Norwich, her close brushes with martyrdom, one just because she preached as a woman. I acknowledge the full sainthood of Eustace who indeed had a difficult and miraculous life followed by martyrdom, but Margery reaches my heart and my vote is for her.
My reaction exactly. Thanks for your words
Susan… it was ‘daring to be a disciple’ that touched me.
Hear. Hear.
Or maybe it was Jaegermeister that they held in such high esteem…
Eustace was amazing but Margery Kempe had 14 children and then went on to preach. what an awesome woman.
Eustace demonstrated great faith, but in a way I cannot relate. Margery’s life is an inspiration in my journey.
Definitely Margery Kempe. This week, we have just experienced the joy of becoming grandparents for the first time, and our daughter in law’s childbirth experience directly influenced my vote today. Also, I am a woman Mennonite pastor, who knows the difficulty of being a “woman who preached.” Go, Margery!
Congratulations on your grandchild, and it’s nice to see a fellow Mennonite commenting! We were in WDC and are now in ACC (we moved, not congregation!) and I’m trying to hook other members into studying saints for Lent. I’m afraid the Mennonite in me forbids voting for Eustace, unless he was turned into a dragon and then restored by a Lion…
Any woman who bears 14 children is a saint. She gets my vote. Ouch!
Really difficult decision when you don’t want to vote for either choice.
Margery is way too good to be true but Eustace is way too strange to be true. or taken seriously.
Yes – but Margery had a priest willing to write her story as she told it, which I took as support for the facts stated in Margery’s testimony.
Picking Eustace as protection from the Black Plague – looks like we need the intercession these days. Stay healthy and wash your hands frequently.
Vote for Eustace who was one of the Holy Helpers because of intercession against illness especially world wide illness. Timely.
margery has way t00 much emotional baggage! Eustace is the one.
I read Margery Kempe’s book, and if I met her I don’t think I could take all the crying, collapsing and shouting she describes doing. Plus, Eustace is the patron saint of Madrid, and I’m going there in the fall, so it’s Eustace for me!
Not to mention that medieval-inspired “Visions of Demons” resulted in the death of over
50,000 souls. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witch_trials_in_the_early_modern_period.
Similar bouts of crying, collapsing, and shouting from hysterical girls led to my
mu-great-grandmother being hung in Salem as a witch One of the thousands of
Martyrs to “Christian” Superstition!”
I agree – to me Margery seems a bit of a nut case. Eustace lived his Christianity through action.
I couldn’t decide until I read in rapid succession the comments from Andrea, Mary C, Beverly and Richard – no more waffling. I smiled, laughed, agreed and voted for Eustace ( who appears not to have the snowball’s proverbial hope!) of a win but I don’t care so another vote for Eustace! And I love the Lent Madness community!!!!!
Patricia
Trying to understand “roasted in a bronze statue”…
the Brazen Bull
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazen_bull
Margery— for bringing post-partum depression into the light.
A saint for all women who suffer post-partum depress?
I voted for Eustace, although I’ve always loved Kemp’s ( especially because of her ties to Julian of Norwich)but in this time of uncertainty with the caronavirus I am going to pray each day to St. Eustace to eradicate this deadly virus fraught with fear and panic and restore our world to health and sanity.
My 9 year old daughter votes for Eustace. She was particularly upset last night about the coronavirus spreading to those she loves. We read about Eustace and his Holy Helpers and knew God was talking directly to her.
Although I’ve always thought that Margery Kempe made up her visions to keep from having more children, I can’t vote for the patron saint of hunters.
This is Leap year, and today is Leap year day. My quick prayer is that no child be born today for he/she will never know what day his/her birthday is. Speaking of children being born, I commiserate with Marjorie for fourteen pregnancies and childbirths and heartily approve her threats of divine punishment against her husband. By the eighteenth century there were condoms made of sheep intestines, for the libertines and rakes. But a medieval wife had nothing but tears, visions, and threats of Jesus. I remember Marjorie from an earlier Lent Madness. We were all repelled by her “gift of tears.” However, this year, with federal judges ruling that yes, we have a king, and not just a king but an absolutist monarch, throwing us back into the seventeenth century, I can better understand how seeing reality clearly and responding with grief could be a legitimate Christian response. Kierkegaard speaks of the leap of faith; one’s spirituality and meaning on earth is defined not in acceptance of a creed but in one’s leap into an unknown mystery. So in honor of leaps of faith, here on Leap year day, I vote for a medieval woman who went out and lived life. She preached! She travelled alone! She faced the stake because . . . woman talking. And yet she persisted. (And yes props to her priest.)
Sorry, I specifically double-checked the spelling of her name and still misspelled it. I mean Margery.
Your posts are always well-written gems.
Thank you for your words. They so often express my feelings!
So well-stated! My vote goes to Margery!
I remember get from a previous year, too, mainly because the phrase “gift of tears” was a new concept to me and it made me think.
Margery dictated the earliest surviving autobiographical writing in English AND preached as a woman AND walked the Camino de Santiago de Compostela AND sought to record the presence of the grace and mercy of God in her life so that God would be glorified – she has my vote today (and I’ve ordered her book)!
Onward, Christian Soldiers! (how the late Rev. Scott Norton Jones, episcopal chaplain, HATED that song.)
But coming from family with deep military tradition(s), I will go with the minority here and ” Hail Eustace”
while dreaming of venison steak after Easter.
In addition to his Jaegermeister label, Eustace could be a poster child for a theology of the cross.
He gets my vote. SDG
Thankful for Lent Madness – how have I not known of some of these amazing people?? After having 14 children, that Margery traveled alone from England to the Holy Land, Rome and walked to Santiago de Compostela is stunning. In the 1300’s it would have been a significant journey just to visit Julian of Norwich. She has my vote!
Oops, sorry – I think Julian of Norwich was right nearby but Canterbury would have been a journey.
Margery Kempe visited Julian of Norwich, she earns my vote that way.
14 children…bless her heart! Still, Eustace went through so much with losing his family, reuniting with them and then them all being burned…I have to go with Eustace.
Celibacy should be a gift, not something forced on another. Eustace, a modern day Job, gets my vote.
Hmmm, from where I stand, celibacy is a right; a sexual relationship is a gift.
Hear Hear!
Thank you.
YES! No one has a “right” to force sexual relations on another, even his spouse.
Nice.
Eustace is no buttercup, no choker in the face of evil! Lift high the Cross! Vote Eustace!
Seriously, SEC??? We go from two clearly Biblical saints, to two barely believable people, neither of whom we want to vote for. So we’re drawing straws today, and Eustace happened to get the better one. As others have said, given the worldwide coronavirus pandemic that the World Health Organization has deemed very high risk while the current administration buries its head in the sand, we’ll take Eustace’s additional prayers.
“We” are learning about the wide range of devotional practices in two millennia of Christian history, and “we” are refusing Biblical literalism and fundamentalism as we do so. After the many schisms that split Christianity into divergent sects and lineages after the early councils (not to mention the upheaval of the Reformation and Counter-Reformation), we have an opportunity to do some healing by encountering and possibly even embracing traditions and lore that have been lost or were rejected along the way. Also “we” are learning to expand our minds and hearts by letting the holy spirit shape us through the glimpses of other souls’ stories and their diverse experiences of the divine. If these two saints blow your mind, wait until you get to vote for St. Guinefort. Truly, whatever you do for the beast of these, you do for me (Matthew 25:40).
Now I know the source of the vision sought by the eldest nun on the Christmas episode of “Call the Midwife”. She longed for a vision of Christ as a white stag, and when visiting the Hebrides, she was granted it. It seemed very strange to me, but now I know the origin of that plot twist.
Nevertheless, I cast my vote for Margery. Anyone who bears fourteen children and still has energy to walk all over Christendom deserves it!
There’s lots of interesting lore about the White Stag (or the White Hart). One of my favorites is the final chapter of The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe: “The Hunting of the White Stag”, in which the four Pevensie children (now adult kings and queens of Narnia) pursue the White Stag, who leads them into the Lantern Waste, and back home to England.
Not to mention Harry Potter’s Patronus charm…
After 14 children, I too would be weeping and praying for hours!
Margery has my vote.
May I vote, instead, for the unfortunate family members of these two who had to put up with the tears, burnings, kidnappings, etc.? I am so fortunately to be neither the spouse nor the child of a saint!
14 children!!! Clearly a saint!
Eustace’s wife was kidnapped, his children taken by “fierce, wild beasts,” and they were all roasted but Eustace is the saint? Give me a break. We don’t seem to know what happened to Margery’s 14 children while she suffered her horrible bouts of postpartum depression, but perhaps her experience of Jesus and her family’s prosperity helped her to care for them. Perhaps those who have read her book could tell us something? But certainly her courage, strength and persistence are as much an inspiration as Eustace’s. And the story of Eustace seems a bit enhanced by legend whereas Margery seems to provide more documentation. A difficult choice, but Margery gets my vote.
If you read one of the contemporary renderings of her autobiographical story, her children are mostly accounted for. One son went into international shipping, others of her children died young.
As we’ve seen with Thomas More, historical fiction has a powerful impact on how we view people. My introduction to Margery Kempe came in “The Book of the Maidservant,” a YA novel by Rebecca Barnhouse, told from the POV of the young maid whom Margery says deserted her. In the book, the maid has good reason to leave! https://www.publishersweekly.com/978-0-375-85856-7
But fictional characterization aside, the book and its thoughtful appendix inspired me to read up on Margery Kempe. I found that though she certainly was bold, unconventional, and courageous, she was also obnoxious and self-absorbed. Whatever her own spirituality, her crying and screaming in public places did not inspire anyone else.
I like that Eustace led an active secular life and stayed loyal to his country and his military honor until he was called on to take one step too far to square with his conscience. He gets my vote.
Well stated.
Outstanding write-ups! I am so thrilled this morning, to have had my imagination filled to the brim with details of Margery and Eustace. I’ve met these two saintly persons here for the first time and it is a pleasure.
It’s refreshing to meet people whose lives were transformed as adults – in the Dark Ages no less. I am also captivated by an idea in Margery’s write-up, that upon her mystic encounter and conversion, Margery didn’t “edit” herself, nevertheless, God drew her into a deep transformative life. Notably, that transformed life involved her family and day to day responsibilities. She also seemed to reach out and grasp for spiritual opportunities as time and circumstances allowed. Wow! She’s a perfect hero for me, a mid-50’s Christian woman, leading a semi-retired life, looking for paths for service and meaning and continued spiritual growth.
Eustace’s tale seemed to track with Margery, and I treasure that as well. On just day 3 of Lent Madness, The magic has happened: I have met a couple lovely saints to add to my personal “Cloud if Witnesses”. Hot dang!
FYI, the fourteenth century is not part of the so-called “Dark Ages.” The Gothic era is well advanced by the fourteenth century. Most of the great Gothic edifices had been erected by this point. For instance, Chartres cathedral was constructed in the 12th century. Marjery’s era is the high medieval period. Consider that the Renaissance is just around the corner.
Is there a place to read all the bios of the participants?
The Saintly Scorecard contains all the bios, a short history of LM and a handy bracket for 2020. It is available from Forward Movement for $3 in printed, Nook, Kindle and Apple Book formats.
http://www.forwardmovement.org/Products/2584/saintly-scorecard-2020.aspx
Margery Kemp should be the Patron Saint of Family Planning
Why’s that? She sure didn’t do it well.
Margery Kempe’s book drove me nuts; I am a psychologist who was diagnosing her with every turn of the page. I think she drove a lot of other people nuts too. Her fellow pilgrims begged her to go home due to her constant noisy crying! She plagued Julian and Jesus about wearing white dresses – -which was against the fashion rules of the church for married women (wiich I thought was rather obssessive). What about hubby and kids? God love her. I voted for St. Eustace, after having had a nun in my Sophomore year homeroom class named Sr. Eustace. So much for voting for folks who exhibited “heroic virtue.”
Eustace has my vote. He is known by the Roman Catholic Church as an intercessor against illness, especially during the Black plague . In our time we have another plague and virus spreading around the world that is causing sickness and fear among many people. May Eustace pray for all who are sick, especially all those effected with this virus and bring them God’s healing touch through Jesus Christ, who took all our ills and infirmities to the cross.
Eustace annoyed me into learning a new word: fakelore — when his tall-tale hagiography reminded me of Pecos Bill and Paul Bunyan, and I started googling.
On the other hand, we know Margery is for real, mood swings and outbursts and amazing travels and all, because we were gifted with her story. (And God bless her priest/scribe!) We are all the richer for her sharing her story. And the whole Body of Christ becomes holier, deeper, and more bound together by true religion whenever we make the space to share and listen to one another’s stories. Following Margery’s lead is what makes the Church the Church, and could lead to much needed renewal and reinvigoration now in these latter days.
Besides, we need a patron saint for postpartum depression. And any woman with 14 kids qualifies as a martyr, too — no bull!
I see what you did there. “Like.”
I have been wavering through the comments on who to vote for. I’m coming down on the side of Margery largely due to your comment. Thank you for putting it so well. Lord help me listen!
That was educational and fun!
I agree on the public displays of tears, and emotional melt-downs which would be a little hard to deal with. I liked that Eustace, despite everything he went through continued steadfast in his beliefs throughout his life. Being from a family with some military as well, I choose Eustace in honor of them. I also have tried and found Jagermeister to be quite likable once!
Eustace sounds fictional to me. And if Margery was friendly to the Lollards as the bio says (which would mean favoring reform of what the Church had become, and favoring the separation of the Chruch from the temporal power of the State), then she’s a friend of mine. I voted Margery.
Margery was real as real. No visionary stags or bronze bulls for this gal!
Why put these two amazingly brave followers of Christ against each other…Come on folks! Even though both were very brave in their witness for Christ, the love of their lives, I must go with Margery. 14 children and then saying no more to her husband. In that time period? And then traveling all by herself around Europe via her mystical encounters with God. In that time period? Think of the dangers and the strength of her connection and trust. Both Margery and Eustace amaze me.
Voting for Eustace only for the Jägermeister I imbibed on Shrove Tuesday before the Lenten fast!
Go Marg!
Had to vote for Margery. She was practical and brave and got things done due to her hard work and determination. She was not even literate and yet accomplished so much.
Eustace, methinks, suffers even more than poor Job. I much prefer the modesty of Elizabeth, although I have a hard time with her vow of chastity after fourteen children, and her death almost cancels out Eustace’s sufferings in the comparison. It’s a tough choice, but I’ll follow the crowd and vote for St. Elizabeth.
Margery for sure. The wacko spinny saint who had a religious experience after she had been hit on the head, by a brick from the roof of the church under repair when she was praying. I wrote a song about her, years ago for some theology class I was in. What a gal. What hutspah!
I know, right? I’m reading her book, and it’s one big lol-fest
Wish I could vote for both!
I cant help to think of Mother Teresa’s quote that says something like if you want to change the world go home and start with your family.
Even though I am women and consider myself a “liberal” christian I feel this is true. I would like to know who took care of all her children? I don’t know a lot about her so maybe leaving her family was taking care if them. Depression is real and can be dangerous. Anyway I’m not completely sure what she did for others. Maybe she paved the way for other women? At least her story seems to be documented so that’s something.
I voted for Eustace.
I’ve noticed the women are winning. Must be mostly women voting.
I think it’s sadly simplistic that women vote for women and men for men when there is a choice. Particularly at this early stage in the game. Over the years I’ve voted for many women against men. I see many women I’ll be supporting in the match-ups ahead. If you’re truly concerned about gender imbalance, why not invite male friends to join in. As for me, I enjoy the company and ideas of women.
Bless you, Richard. Thank you for your thoughtful and generous response. I thought about replying and then passed on by as my response would have been sharper. Thank you for posting a comment true to the spirit of Lent Madness. “Like.” “Two thumbs up.”
Today’s choice was hard not because both candidates were so very outstanding but rather because to me both seemed ‘why were they part of the line up?’. I caste my vote for Margery. She had to be very brave to travel around the known world on her own and bless her for having the foresight to leave us her words of wisdom to ponder. P.S. I don’t think it would have taken me 14 children before figuring out how that happened and putting a stop to it!!
Eustace, patron saint of trappers, in honor of my great grandfather.
Eustace has me a bit confused. I lived in Bavaria the church celebrations for hunters were all around St. Hubertus. When we were in the forests, giving thanks for the harvested animals and toasting the hunters with Jaegermeister, it was with a memory of Hubertus. So, Eustace is new to me and I am thankful for this remembrance of his life.
Poor Eustace. Just when you think things couldn’t get any worse…
“Margery describes Jesus coming to her, saying to her she was not forsaken but loved. Margery devotes herself to Christ, eventually (after fourteen children) forcing her husband to honor her decision to live a life of chastity, calling on God to terrify her husband when he feels a desire to break this vow.” God surely could smite her husband it he even looked at her sideways.
I could have voted for Margery as last fall I walked the Camino de Santiago. I instead voted for Eustace. What spoke to me, regardless that his story is true or not, is relevant to current politics. That is a story of courage to change from following a ruler cult of persecution to one of deep public service.
One vote in
One Vote for 4 years Celebrating Leap Day 2/29/2020 with a vote 4
Margery in honor of our former priest Marjorie
Margery Kempe
Oh dear, underwhelmed by both of these saints. Margery because I feel embarrassed just reading about the hours of public weeping and tears. Eustace because of the position he put his family in, and also because I can’t bring myself to vote for the patron saint of hunting and trapping when the lion and wolf appear to have left his children unharmed. In the end I voted for Margery who visited Julian in Norwich which is where I currently live.
From the Wikipedia entry about the “brazen bull” execution device: The Catholic Church discounts the story of Saint Eustace’s martyrdom as “completely false”.[8] Footnote 8 is this: “Martyrologium Romanum” (Libreria Editrice Vaticana, 2001 ISBN 88-209-7210-7)
I voted for Margery Kempe in honor of Margery Wolcott, a member of St. Mary’s Cathedral in Memphis, TN. Our Margery is a Co-Founder of Constance Abbey where people dealing with homelessness and others in need can find a place to take a shower, wash their clothes, grab a bite to eat, spend the night, find a shoulder to cry on, get help finding a job or just wishing for a cat to pet. Lots of love to share plus the knowledge that God is good. All the time.
And all the time, God is good. Love your reason.
I’ll admit to initially finding Margery’s overabundance of tears off-putting, but after reading this in Robert Ellsberg’s book All Saints: ” She also committed herself to celibacy. Unfortunately, her husband did not immediately share this commitment, a source of ongoing marital discord that lasted throughout many years and the birth of many more children…When she was about forty she finally won her husband’s consent to accept a mutual vow of chastity.” I think perhaps she’s a saint for those women who didn’t have a choice or those whose only way of being heard is loud weeping. Today my vote goes to the one some of her contemporaries referred to as “a holy nuisance.”
Today’s matchup is a disappointing “no contest,” pitting a saint (Eustace) the story of whose life is entirely based on late and unreliable legend and who may not even have existed, versus a real person whose amazing adventurous life and great spiritual struggles and depth we know from her own (dictated) autobiography. Of course I voted for Margery! I wish Lent Madness would give us people we actually know something about, not the stuff of imaginative legend, however charming.
Both worthy challengers, but Margery gets my vote for the account of the consolation she took from her experience of God’s love.
I had to go for Eustace. If I had birthed 14 kids, I’d have gone crazy and tried anything to get out of having a 15th. She really knew how to cry.
There is a little cafe in Rome, to which I make a biennial pilgrimage, for it has the best espresso I have ever tasted. Sant’Eustachio gets my vote today!
https://santeustachioilcaffe.com/en/
It’s a shame he’s likely to lose today… The Saintly Kitsch round would have been perfect for him…
Yes! It’s my favorite espresso in Rome as well. I even wrote about the place in Holy Grounds, my book about coffee and faith. https://www.amazon.com/Holy-Grounds-Surprising-Connection-between/dp/1506448232
Margery’s write-up left out some interesting bits, such as the fact that her fellow pilgrims to the Holy Land found her so annoying that they threw her off the tour once their boat docked in the Mediterranean on the return trip. She had to hire a monk to guide her home over the Alps, but of course she made it back home to England. Her neighbors mostly couldn’t abide her either but finally softened toward her because she took such wonderful care of her disabled husband at the end of his life.
Ladies and gentlemen,if you can’t get past the demons,tears.depression and a whole host of mental issues then you have never been in an 8th grade public school classroom. I taught middle school for 20 years and none of these scare me as much as 34 8th graders and their drama. Granted I loved them and loved teaching. Having 14 children!!!!!! I would be depressed too. (LOL)Margery had to have my vote.
The poor woman needed more than consolation. She needed tranquilizers. I believe they say God will provide and He did.
The memes are wonderful and the comments are enlightening. Enjoying my 1st Saintly smack down.
Just an FYI. I just had eye surgery so my typing (which is never the greatest anyway) is probably even worse.
So very sorry.
I hope you heal quickly. Teaching middle school for 20 years may make you eligible for the saint’s list. Bless you!
Anyone who has borne 14 children is a saint and deserves my vote. Sorry Eustace.
Birthing 14 children is nothing to sneeze at, but if you do sneeze be sure it is on your elbow.
TBH, I felt called to vote for Eustachius, who despite loss of privilege, loss of wealth, loss of servants, and temporary separation from his wife and sons remained faithful to Christ even to the point of martyrdom.
Hear. Hear.
Forces husband into celebecy…typical
Calling Richard the Chalice Bearer . . . Help!
Excuse me? Typical of what? I’m noticing a bit of repressed anger here. Might I suggest no one should be required to submit to someone else’s demands regarding their own person, no matter what the prior relationship. Margery’s husband had many more options available to him at that time than she did. If he respected her wishes, spiritually inspired as they were, I only have more admiration for them both. Your comment is not appropriate, particularly on a site devoted to Lent. If you meant it as humorous, you have failed badly.
She didn’t force him…she desired to be celibate but he didn’t want to until she was 40 and he had plenty of progeny by then.
While Eustachius’ life certainly wasn’t a bed of roses, and he is to commended for his loyalty to Christianity, Margery won my heart today. I ask, what’s not to love about her! She birthed 14 children, and then set out dictating book, meets the Archbishop of Canterbury, is almost burned as a Lollard, visits with Julian of Norwich, and is arrested and examined as a heretic because she preached…as a woman. Margery travels alone to the Holy Land, Assisi, and Rome, walks the Santiago de Compostela, and engages in conversation with Christian mystics from all across Europe. She’s a hero in my book (if I ever write it).
That being said, I will admit that I am enjoying the limericks! Thanks so much!
Margery Kempe all the way! I lost it after reading this sentence — “Margery devotes herself to Christ, eventually (after fourteen children) forcing her husband to honor her decision to live a life of chastity, calling on God to terrify her husband when he feels a desire to break this vow.” Wouldn’t want to mess with her!
Eustace. I agree that we could use his intercession right now.
In Today’s match-up, the deer with the cross in the middle also reminded me of a movie I have read about, but haven’t seen. I’ve also been debating about it but it’s called “Hunting for God”, has Duane Chapman in it and although I never watch his program that much at all I happened to notice the trailer once, was curious and took a look. It had the same deer with the cross in the middle in the advertisement.
I was all for Margaret until I read Eustachius was the patron St of Madrid. Where my nephew lives and where I and my family are traveling to this fall. Oooooh tough choice. Went w magaret in the end cause she was a kick ass woman and I want to read her book.
The deer in the movie has an empty cross between the antlers, however, not the image of Christ on the cross as Eustace had the vision of. I also noticed underneath the trailer the description labeled it as “Christian Horror” on IMDB. The trailer I decided was also a little too far-fetched for me!
Although Margery’s story is interesting, I vote Eustace due to his devotion of his faith. He continued to serve the Roman empire but stayed true to his faith and family. His faith was strong though it did cost all in his family to be killed in a horrific way.
Margery is a woman’s woman. I can relate to where she is coming from. And to relate her experiences and emotions being illiterate? This could happen today. I voted for her. Eustace? another St. Paul? And di he really convince his family members to be baptized on their own volition? Who knows?
Margery gets my vote,learning so much on this Lenten Madness,thank you!
Margery gets my vote
Sad that I couldn’t vote, because I was offline on Saturday. Maybe you shouldn’t close voting, but keep track of whom has voted?
I don’t know whether my vote registered or not, as I didn’t realize that yesterday was a saintly voting day until I was reading through my emails today (Sunday). Then I voted, for Margery, one of the large company of mystics whom I have been blessed to know through their writings. As a retired female Elder (clergy) in the United Methodist Church, I can identify with some people not wanting to listen to a female preach, while others consider themselves blessed by our presence. God bless her and all the others who bear witness to his presence in their lives.
Oops! Typo in my own name! Sorry!
Well that was a tough one. Margery certainly sounds very interesting and inspiring (to be honest, martyrs intimidate me. Can I say that and still be Catholic?) However, having had a rough day with medical tests, all the talk of COVID-19 and currently reading Dante’s Inferno… St Eustace all the way today.
Help! I could not vote today. I couldn’t even read about the two saints. I did not vote twice. If I did it was very unintentional. Please help. This is my favorite Lenten thing to do